Rims and sizes

eliteguy50 · Post by **eliteguy50** » Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:21 am

so the nq50 and sb50 run the same rim: 1.5x10 and uses the smallest brake hub (75mm)
the nb50, 87-93 elite50 (non sb models) and gyro (front rim only) all use the same rim: 1.85x10 with an 80mm brake hub
the 94-2001 elite50 uses a 1.85x10 rim but with a larger brake hub than the prior models (95mm)
(rim width and diameter are inches, brake hubs are milimeters, all engine measurements are cubic centimeters)

Is this correct?

edit: updated with Wheelman's info

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:33 am

Greetings:

Your rim sizes are correct. However the Spree uses an even-smaller brake hub; 75mm methinks. The axles and spacers may also be different.

Aero was 80mm. 2001 Elite is 95. Metro rims are tubeless 2.15 and the rears fit the Aero/early/late Elites. Someone said the fronts do/can be adapted too. I haven't tried a Met front yet.

mousewheels · Post by **mousewheels** » Mon Jan 25, 2010 1:06 am

eliteguy50 - good topic, there are many differences between models.

Brake drum diameters are listed in the table below. Also, Brake shoe width varied between models, as well as the length of the brake actuating arm. Spree/SB50 has a shorter arm than the Aero/Elites. I think Honda put limits on how much brake a rider got when a handful of lever pull was applied. As Wheelman states the spacer and axle bolt length vary too, beware when picking up parts from other models for all the above reasons.

Data for the table is from Honda service manuals.

I'll put together a table with rim width, brake drum dia and brake shoe P/N tables for the various models.

-- mousewheels

eliteguy50 · Post by **eliteguy50** » Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:16 am

mousewheels wrote:Brake shoe width varied between models

is the brake drum itself different? Will a rim from one not work on another that is the same diameter?

mousewheels · Post by **mousewheels** » Thu Jan 28, 2010 11:32 pm

Wheelman's reply to eliteguy50 wrote: ...Your rim sizes are correct. However the Spree uses an even-smaller brake hub; 75mm methinks

Hmm, not sure what's up with the size differences we are finding. I've dug through the service manuals for the Spree and Elite SB50, both say 80mm for the front drum. Measured my Spree hub at ~3.14" which is ~79.8mm.

eliteguy50 wrote:is the brake drum itself different? Will a rim from one not work on another that is the same diameter?

The hub and brake panel may not interchange between models. I think the similar 85-97 Aero/87 Elite SE/88-93 Elite SA50 front wheels and brake panel interchange, but don't have the parts here to verify.

Between the Spree and 87Aero there are differences. Drum/panels are compatible only as a matched set:

Spree brake panel / Aero drum - Fails because the flange of the brake panel contacts the brake drum.
Aero brake panel / Spree drum - Fails because the brake panel will not seat leaving a gap between hub and panel.

The overall width between the fork blades varies. Not just at the spacer, but the brake panel is thinner on the Spree.
I'll post more photos to detail the differences this weekend.
--- mousewheels

Photos below cover the drum differences Spree vs Aero. Last photo shows the brake shoe differences I'd mentioned earlier.

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Fri Jan 29, 2010 9:14 am

Greetings:

I stand corrected. Less swept area but same 80mm diameter for the Spree vs. Aero. Thanks for setting me right.

mousewheels · Post by **mousewheels** » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:07 am

eliteguy50 wrote:the nb50, 87-93 elite50 (non sb models) and gyro (front rim only) all use the same rim: 1.85x10 with an 80mm brake hub

Couple comments here - My 87 NB50 had 1.5" rims front & rear. Anyone else have a 1.5" rim on their NB50 or pre-94 SA50's? The 86/86 Gyro TG50 front wheel is 1.85x10, but will check an '84 NN50 Gyro, I think it is 1.5x10.
---
Pic below compares the Aero vs Spree front hub. Also can't be seen in the pic, but the brake cable ferrules are different dia. The depth of the casting to the fork seating surface does not account for much of the reduced fork width. Turns out the drum on the Spree is not as deep. Meaning the hub side nestles deeper from the rim edge.

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:38 am

Greetings:

Great info, Mouse. Put it in Tech Docs?

I noticed the difference in the lengths of the brake actuating arm as well. It looks like the tang that engages the forks is quite different too. Is it even possible at least to mount the wider Aero assembly and wheel to a Spree fork? Maybe with creative use of spacers? The extra braking power might be welcome for the BBK and engine-swapped Sprees that run north of 40.

mousewheels · Post by **mousewheels** » Sat Feb 06, 2010 6:23 pm

Wheelman-111 wrote:...It looks like the tang that engages the forks is quite different too. Is it even possible at least to mount the wider Aero assembly and wheel to a Spree fork?

We don't have a Spree, so the info below has not gone into an actual scooter, but it sure looks possible.

Use an Aero 50 front rim and hub.
Swap in a Spree front axle
Swap in a Spree axle spacer.
Machine the Aero 50 shorter, then the brake tab looks like it would fit
The Aero hub casting has a larger hole for the brake cable ferrule. Spree ferrules differ anyway between the 84-87 years. Parts list says 85/85/86 are the same. 87 is larger dia. Conflicting info for the '86 model is a member found his 86 needed an '87 cable.

Photo below illustrates the width differences, and how the fork tang would fit once the hub was adjusted to the Spree width.

Great info, Mouse. Put it in Tech Docs?

Thanks man! Will do when info is more complete for the table earlier in the thread.

elitedio · Post by **elitedio** » Sun Feb 07, 2010 2:57 pm

Impressive research! I sure notice a big difference in power and control between my 95mm back brake and my 80mm front brake.

madskater1987 · Post by **madskater1987** » Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:49 pm

ok so I was given a 87 elite parts bike and I decided to try out the elite front wheel and brake assembely on my spree. So to get it all to mount up properly you must cut just over 1/4 inch off the elite hub to get it down to the width of the spree hub. Then you use the spree wheel spacer plus 1/4 inch spacer the the same side. Now every thing will mount up to the spree forks. But there is still one more step. In order for the speedo to work you must mount the brake hub on the other side than stock placement. Now you need to cut a tab and weld to you fork so the brake drum will lock in place.

I will get some pics up tomorow(need batterys for camera)

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:21 am

Greetings:

Would using a Metropolitan 95mm brake panel offer any advantages? The fork locking boss is oriented for a Telescopic fork like the Spree.

bradthreee · Post by **bradthreee** » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:36 am

Anyone else have a 1.5" rim on their NB50 or pre-94 SA50's?

The 84 Aero I am currently parting has 1.5" rims

mousewheels · Post by **mousewheels** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 12:56 am

bradthree wrote:The 84 Aero I am currently parting has 1.5" rims

Hey - Thanks for adding your info

All -
I'm making a table for the 'wiki' from this thread. Changes from early in this thread are the Aero rims were 1.50" rim instead of 1.85"

Couple items to check with the group:

The Elite SE50 rim has different part number from the Aeros, is it 1.85 wide?
Added the Met/Ruckus rows, does the info look correct?

Thank you!

eliteguy50 · Post by **eliteguy50** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:42 am

3.0 is too small for a ruckus rim width. I can measure it when I get home but I am sure it is wider than that.

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