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[zadman2012]

o.k. -- I'm going to attempt what has been suggested with the hoses from control box to carb&manifold. For tonight, I'll basically cut hose 1 and 2, and cap off & label all 4 resulting loose ends. then I'll try running the scooter up to operating temp. Tomorrow I'll go get a nice ball valve with barbed ends. Considering the intended use (gasoline) do I need anything special? Thanks much.

[Bear45-70]

Mostly air but a plastic valve would be a bad idea.

[breaze]

Seems like you should slow down a little and take the advice of taking it back to stock. That device (whatever it is) doesn't seem to have anything to do with the bystarter - it looks to somehow be supplementing or replacing the main fuel line. On the bottom of your tank is an automatic fuel valve (petcock) - it has 2 lines coming from it - the bigger one supplys fuel to the carb, the smaller is attached to the manifold. Vacuum from the manifold opens the petcock and allows fuel to flow into the carb. Make sure that system is working properly - it may be that rather than buy a new petcock, the PO has rigged something up when it stopped working. The petcock can be checked simply enough - remove the vacuum line and fuel line from the manifold and carb - the fuel line should not allow fuel to flow unless there is vacuum - suck on the vacuum line and fuel shold flow.

Look at Bear's picture - you have all those extra lines attached and your fuel hose is attached to that device somehow - is there any way to contact the PO and find out what he/she was trying to accomplish? You may also want to find out if he/she did any other mods - an after market air filter like that may indicate bigger jetting, if not, then it will be running lean.

Is it possible they were trying to add more fuel to the system thru that device - who knows?

You need to do more figgerin and less experimentin - have you downloaded the service manual?

[zadman2012]

not to be rude, but I have made it clear, twice, that I too value leaving things alone when prudent but that I ALSO have determined that functional or not, a 6 hose vaccuum appliance I don't absolutely need (bystarter) is getting removed most definitely. Being that I have a skilled person (bear) offering suggestions on how to do that, let's move on from multiple lectures on restoring a 28 year old scooter to showroom condition. I am not "experimenting." The "aftermarket air cleaner?" That's what's left of the stock airbox and the bone stock foam aircleaner element, held on by baling wire, just like I found it WHEN I bought it, just like I said. The only modification I myself have made is the sparkplug boot, as I mentioned before. The fuel hose "all those extra" you refer to is the 2 blue hoses clearly shown in the video as being connected to the primer device, also shown in the video -- it is tapped into the original fuel line to the carb -- again, not my work. I said I was 41, not 14. I am not trying to undo my own fiddling here done out of childish boredom, but rather to remove a device that is of a type (heat/vaccuum operated automatic choke) that, Honda or not, grates on my nerves in it's intended PROPER functioning let alone in malfunction and that I will remove if it is reasonably possible. Other than that, it shall remain largely stock. Mild changes to improve general daily use, not "experimentation." I most likely have some vaccuum leaks to track down and may find the bystarter works, as I suspect already, just fine. It will be disabled regardless. Thank you for attempts to help, but labelling my general intent as loose cannon modifying for the second time is actually quite unneccessary. Yes, I have the pdf manual. The po told me that the bystarter was "wonky," but my observations show it as being more dirty than anything. I will install a ballvalve in the same hole the po made for his "lawnmower primer." I shall make the device Bear has made and for the same purpose. I suppose clear fuel lines are unneccessary and non stock also but I want to have them as well. Leaving things alone when improvements could be made is as bad if not worse than dinking around aimlessly, which isn't what I am am doing to begin with.

[breaze]

I meant no offense and you're right - it did sound condescending.

My appologies - I get carried away but was only trying to help.

Good luck and you're making a wise choice to listen to Bear.

[zadman2012]

No worries, as I'm not so much offended as wanting to nip the idea of absolutely stock as mandatory in the bud. I value all advice from experienced folks. I just want to stop the insistence upon keeping it totally stock. I'll keep it sane, honest. All I meant was "I hear your opinion on the modification planned but it IS going to happen and will be done right, with careful planning." I'm not a hot rodder type. Just a broke guy finally getting fulltime work and finding his fat butt needs more snort out of his scooter that he could ill afford when purchased -- with money coming in, I can now make this thing a solid commuter for summer and carpool in the winter. It's highly scary AND embarrassing to see the cars lined up behind me for 3 blocks as I creep up to speed, only to hit ANOTHER red light and do it again, all the way to work and back home. from 10 mph to almost 40 she really moves, but idle to 10 mph, and it's "sputter, sputter, sputter, creeeeeeeeeeep..." So, once she gets going, it's time to brake again...

Honda makes fine machines. I love them all. However, there are occasionally items in any design, even one of theirs, that rubs me the wrong way enough that I do begin to feel I must make a change. I have done a more massive search than is apparent... the changes I intend to make are designed for increasing acceleration notably in aggressive traffic and a slight increase in top speed as well (I honestly don't care about +35 speeds personally, but for safety here in Boise, I need 45 or very close and dropping to 25 on the hills is not O.K.) I heard repeatedly that I would not care for the Aero125 though I see them listed a LOT online for sale used. Nobody will finance me for a bigger scooter new (too new in my job.)
Time and time again, I was told "for what you want, get (specifically) an Aero 80," and from various folks, "upgrade intake, carb, and exhaust." I actually have been almost hit due to the "relaxed" way this thing accelerates to about 10 mph. New belt and rollers weren't enough. The existing carb has to go but for a few weeks I am stuck with it, so I'll fix it as best I can for the few bucks I can spare and then keep it in case I need it later after I can get the intake Bear suggests and the carb as well. Going with the 21mm or the 24mm...still unsure-- further hemming and hawing is needed.

Next question I have is, based on my reading last night... Is it worth the fairly big bucks for an expansion chamber if I don't do a BBK?
Like I said, I think those drag scooters are awesome, but I don't want to drive one. Is exhaust best left to the hotrodder scoots? Thanks.

[motormike]

I most likely have some vaccuum leaks to track down and may find the bystarter works, as I suspect already, just fine. It will be disabled regardless.

This portion of your post has me wondering what is your logic ? The bystarter, if found to be functioning properly, you will trash regardless ?...hey it's your scooter. The electric choke on my truck works fine, but I'm not going to disable it and try to replace it with something else, regardless.....

[Bear45-70]

............................It's highly scary AND embarrassing to see the cars lined up behind me for 3 blocks as I creep up to speed, only to hit ANOTHER red light and do it again, all the way to work and back home. from 10 mph to almost 40 she really moves, but idle to 10 mph, and it's "sputter, sputter, sputter, creeeeeeeeeeep..." So, once she gets going, it's time to brake again... In my opinion the reason the scooter is a dog off the line is the the bystarter is making it run very rich and once you get about 4000 RPM the engine will handle the extra fuel. Mine does if I forget to the the valve.

Honda makes fine machines. I love them all. However, there are occasionally items in any design, even one of theirs, that rubs me the wrong way enough that I do begin to feel I must make a change. I have done a more massive search than is apparent... the changes I intend to make are designed for increasing acceleration notably in aggressive traffic and a slight increase in top speed as well (I honestly don't care about +35 speeds personally, but for safety here in Boise, I need 45 or very close and dropping to 25 on the hills is not O.K.) I heard repeatedly that I would not care for the Aero125 though I see them listed a LOT online for sale used. Nobody will finance me for a bigger scooter new (too new in my job.) A stock Aero 125 would easily meet your requirements. But so will a slightly modded Aero 80.
Time and time again, I was told "for what you want, get (specifically) an Aero 80," and from various folks, "upgrade intake, carb, and exhaust." I actually have been almost hit due to the "relaxed" way this thing accelerates to about 10 mph. New belt and rollers weren't enough. The existing carb has to go but for a few weeks I am stuck with it, so I'll fix it as best I can for the few bucks I can spare and then keep it in case I need it later after I can get the intake Bear suggests and the carb as well. Going with the 21mm or the 24mm...still unsure-- further hemming and hawing is needed. I now have both carbs but will try the 24 first as the necessary jets are know. Then will try the 21 on the second Aero 80.

Next question I have is, based on my reading last night... Is it worth the fairly big bucks for an expansion chamber if I don't do a BBK? There are no presently produced aftermarket pipes for the Aero 80. You can sometimes find left overs or used in Europe. If you are interested PM me I and will send you the info. I actually have a home made pipe (not by me) for the Aero 80 but have not tried it and really have no burning desire to try it at this time, because I think the stock pipe will be good to 55 mph.
Like I said, I think those drag scooters are awesome, but I don't want to drive one. Is exhaust best left to the hotrodder scoots? In my opinion, Yes.Thanks.

[zadman2012]

well, the valve is in. cold start is easy as pie. still stumbles
off the line but a fair bit less. my test run was over to carl's cycles... he spent a half hour looking around and charged me $20.70 for a handful of gaskets which he put in for me. He said it is pitted badly throughout and not long for this world and to never run ethanol blend again. Oops.
a new stock carb $35. The setup I want, around $70.
at least it idles now and is safe to run on the roads. I await payday, the 15th when I can get the carb and intake I want.

[zadman2012]

thanks Bear. I saw the "arrow" exhaust on the telus Aero80 page... It looks like a bit of trimming on the right panel will allow it, but if it isn't worth the effort, I'll just roast the stock muffler to get some gunk out of it and put it back. I got a bottom half of an airbox today, and can now at least stop worrying about my air cleaner element falling off. No lid or retaining wire thingy yet. The carl's cycle guy said my reed valve, and I quote, "looks like ****." -- he also said my intake pipe was pretty funky looking inside as well as the carb body. Apparently the idle screw is broken or was rammed into it's seat or something, so it doesn't really work anymore. Basically, this carb is not worth rebuilding properly. The jet's too small, I don't like the bystarter anyway... no big loss. He was all in favor of the dio intake and mentioned that any number of options existed for better flowing carb. Oddly, he didn't seem to think much of the "oko" carbs I hear so much about.


Bear wrote: In my opinion the reason the scooter is a dog off the line is the the bystarter is making it run very rich and once you get about 4000 RPM the engine will handle the extra fuel. Mine does if I forget to the the valve.

-- yes, it seems so. however, my carb/intake seems to be ailing, so my original plan seems more prudent than ever, in spite of NAYSAYERS who likely sit in the dark to avoid possibly damaging the light socket by putting in a new bulb.


pics of the day's efforts:

[zadman2012]

I most likely have some vaccuum leaks to track down and may find the bystarter works, as I suspect already, just fine. It will be disabled regardless.

This portion of your post has me wondering what is your logic ? The bystarter, if found to be functioning properly, you will trash regardless ?...hey it's your scooter. The electric choke on my truck works fine, but I'm not going to disable it and try to replace it with something else, regardless.....

not trashing it, just pulling the 2 hoses suggested. Disabled, as in, not using it. I can tell an alpha personality when I see it. Let's just agree to disagree. I don't want it, and will not use it. "nuff said.

[Bear45-70]

The '83 and '84 Aero 80 came with an 88 main jet, which was EPA lean. A 90 main jet cures this. You can replace the stock reeds with some Boyesen dual stage reeds #740. They will improve the off the line performance and help the top end a bit or you can go with the CT intake and a 21 or 24 carb. You will be running a pod filter on this set up, so the air box becomes mute.

[zadman2012]

The '83 and '84 Aero 80 came with an 88 main jet, which was EPA lean. A 90 main jet cures this. You can replace the stock reeds with some Boyesen dual stage reeds #740. They will improve the off the line performance and help the top end a bit or you can go with the CT intake and a 21 or 24 carb. You will be running a pod filter on this set up, so the air box becomes mute.

is this the mikuni on a 21/24, or another? I hear of OKO carbs also. I had no idea small engine carbs were so varied.
when I first started looking, all I saw were references to mikuni20mm and dio intakes. now, lately, it is the dio intake you linked to and these OKO carbs. I want a bit more grunt on the bottom and would LIKE45-50 mph top.

[motormike]

I most likely have some vaccuum leaks to track down and may find the bystarter works, as I suspect already, just fine. It will be disabled regardless.

This portion of your post has me wondering what is your logic ? The bystarter, if found to be functioning properly, you will trash regardless ?...hey it's your scooter. The electric choke on my truck works fine, but I'm not going to disable it and try to replace it with something else, regardless.....

not trashing it, just pulling the 2 hoses suggested. Disabled, as in, not using it. I can tell an alpha personality when I see it. Let's just agree to disagree. I don't want it, and will not use it. "nuff said.

....okay.... ...makes sense if you are replacing the carb with a CT intake and 21-24mm OKO (or another brand)...my choice was Mikuni 24mm flat-slide for my Aero 125...I am pleased with the performance and ease of tuning. Hope the airbox will fit your choice. In my case, the increase in carb size and the extra intake length prohibited use of airbox, currently running K&N... <alpha

[zadman2012]

....okay.... ...makes sense if you are replacing the carb with a CT intake and 21-24mm OKO (or another brand)...my choice was Mikuni 24mm flat-slide for my Aero 125...I am pleased with the performance and ease of tuning. Hope the airbox will fit your choice. In my case, the increase in carb size and the extra intake length prohibited use of airbox, currently running K&N... <alpha [/quote]

Ah. is that one of those "pod" filters Bear spoke of?