Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

This year i went ahead and did everything i wanted to do last year to my '85 spree and cleaned the carb,petcock,replaced spark plug and gave it fresh gas and everything seemed great. The only problem i've had in the 1 year i've owned it is it seems like the bystarter has never worked right so i've just held the throttle open slightly so it doesn't die till it warms up,but the problem i have is on my way home this afternoon it was starting to slow down for no reason so i opened the throttle all the way and i knew something was up cus i had to keep it revd at stop lights and it was moving much faster then it had been. I've been getting it to like 27 and it was hitting 30 no problem however it finally just stopped about half mile from home. It's odd because when i try to start it the engine gets super close but just doesn't quite catch. I have no idea what happened and was hoping to maybe find an answer on here

If you didn't run out of gas, you may have blown the left crankshaft seal out of the engine. It is under the front pulley under the side belt cover. Before you start work on it, open the drain screw at the bottom of the carb and make sure a lot of gas runs out. If it does, then have a look at these posts. You can verify if this is the problem without taking off the side cover with a vacuum gauge. More details about that in the first of these two posts.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=31793&p=276777&hili ... al#p276777
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=33617&p=291742&hili ... al#p291742

If you search the forum for Crankshaft seal, you will see a lot of posts. It is very common that they blow out. Please report back on what you find out.

I haven't gotten to pulling stuff apart yet but if the seals are blown is the scooter still good? Would i be able to replace the seals and ride again?

First of all, if a seal blew out, it was only one, and typically, it is the left one which is the easiest one to change. The seal is still available from your Honda dealer, or you can just push the old seal back into place if you want to use your old one. The part number is 91201-GK8-003 OIL SEAL (15.6X23.5X7) and it should cost less than $10. If that is the problem, installing a new seal is easy and your Spree will run just as well as before the seal blew out. Please use the search feature in this forum to read more about it and how to install a new seal. Again, a blown out seal might not be your problem. It is just my best guess, based on your initial report.

Would you see alot of oil if a seal blew? I don't see any oil. And i pulled the screw on tge bottom of the carb and gas is flowing

No, The only thing behind the seal when the engine is running is a air, gasoline, and the tiny amount of oil that your oil pump automatically mixes with the gasoline. During the split second that your seal blew out (again, if this is the problem) a small blast of this mixture might have come out behind the front pulley, but it would all be evaporated by now. Please do the inspection before asking any more questions, much appreciated. You have proven that the engine didn't run out of gasoline, and that is good and it does add more credence to the problem being a blown out left seal.

Greetings:

The assertion that the scooter got faster, briefly, before dying supports the hypothesis that a vacuum leak formed. It could result from a crank end seal, but there are lots of other places where such a leak can arise, starting with the rubber from the airbox going all the way to the exhaust flange.

One concern is that while the increase in speed may be welcome, the lean-induced increase in engine heat may have caused something more critical than a seal to fail. Have a look at the spark plug. I suspect it will be light-colored or even white. While the plug is out, I'd recommend a compression test.

Wheelman-111 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 30, 2023 9:50 amThe assertion that the scooter got faster, briefly, before dying supports the hypothesis that a vacuum leak formed.

+1. I'd just do the compression test now, especially since the bike won't start. Then start looking for air leaks, including those crank seals.

vintagegarage wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 8:06 am First of all, if a seal blew out, it was only one, and typically, it is the left one which is the easiest one to change. The seal is still available from your Honda dealer, or you can just push the old seal back into place if you want to use your old one. The part number is 91201-GK8-003 OIL SEAL (15.6X23.5X7)

These are going out on all the bikes, aren't they? Perhaps it's time to start putting them into a kit to sell w/ the rest of the gaskets.

There's two different sizes used, right? IIRC the early Spree used a smaller size than later. Or there was some other difference in the case... I'll have to look through the parts catalog.

If my memory serves me, each side of the crank is different sizes. Its been a minute since I’ve done them. I do remember there being a helpful youtube video on how to yank the old ones out using basic tools without scratching up the crank. They make a special tool for pulling them but last I looked it was like $50. Not practical unless you do them all the time.

They're definitely different left and right, but for some reason I thought there was a different crankshaft by year. I may be confusing it with the Elites of same era... or wristpins? It's embarrassing how long it's been since I've owned or worked on one.

I'm finally back. Took forever to get the seal in the mail but after looking everything over it made no sence but the seal to be bad so i replaced it yesterday and it fired up and drove. Still having some other issues but it is driving again

That is a puzzle, and I am concerned that you didn't find that the seal had blown out and was just sitting on the end of the crankshaft where you could take it off by hand with no tools. If that wasn't the case, then I don't think your new seal was the answer to solving your problem. Was your old seal still firmly in place when you removed the front pulley?