Flash 3.26
Moderator: Moderator
- SpyderMike
- Elite
- Posts: 319
- Joined: Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:33 pm
- Location: Racine, WI
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
those are some nice results... but im going to need the maker/part # of that belt you plan to try out, as i was about to start the search for the vary same one today
Re: Flash III Hits 65 (Pre-Transposed for You Dyslexics...)
Have you considered a forced air cooling scoop on your vent?Wheelman-111 wrote:Oddly it continues to show highest temps cruising 35 at low throttle openings.
...
That said, it's nagging me that Flash II demonstrated faster speeds.
Also: I know you are interested in logevity, but what about pushing the gear ratio for a bit more top?
1993 Elite - The Mad Max
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
Greetings:
Re Pushing the Gear Ratio: Sheesh, Mr. Pibbs, I just put the 9:1s in! Already a bit of a drawback from 0-5. I'm not sure how useful a painful slow climb to 61.3MPH will be up from 55 I currently enjoy. Especially so if the takeoff suffers more... I'll see how much (if any) benefit I get from the belt-drive mods below.
Air scoops can behave unpredictably. Ya never know just which way to point them things with all the ground-effects turbulence going on down there. I think I just need to monkey with my midrange a bit more. Maybe a smaller main but lift the needle a click...
For SpyderMike:
It's the one on the bottom. Fetched all the way from Germany for an obscene price. Listed by Scooter-Center.com as a replacement belt for some Euro Derbi model. But it gots that Highly Technical Kev-U-Lar woven rat in thar. It's ~18mm longer -measured the long way 'round, not some theoretical value - than stock and 17.5mm wide. I plan to insert a shim behind the boss to let it get down to center in front while the length gives it the slack to ride the rim out back = theoretically better take-off from lower gearing. (?Remains to be seen...) What I don't know is the clearance if it comes up proud of the Drive Face at full boogie. That starter housing may run afoul.
Re Pushing the Gear Ratio: Sheesh, Mr. Pibbs, I just put the 9:1s in! Already a bit of a drawback from 0-5. I'm not sure how useful a painful slow climb to 61.3MPH will be up from 55 I currently enjoy. Especially so if the takeoff suffers more... I'll see how much (if any) benefit I get from the belt-drive mods below.
Air scoops can behave unpredictably. Ya never know just which way to point them things with all the ground-effects turbulence going on down there. I think I just need to monkey with my midrange a bit more. Maybe a smaller main but lift the needle a click...
For SpyderMike:
It's the one on the bottom. Fetched all the way from Germany for an obscene price. Listed by Scooter-Center.com as a replacement belt for some Euro Derbi model. But it gots that Highly Technical Kev-U-Lar woven rat in thar. It's ~18mm longer -measured the long way 'round, not some theoretical value - than stock and 17.5mm wide. I plan to insert a shim behind the boss to let it get down to center in front while the length gives it the slack to ride the rim out back = theoretically better take-off from lower gearing. (?Remains to be seen...) What I don't know is the clearance if it comes up proud of the Drive Face at full boogie. That starter housing may run afoul.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
- SpyderMike
- Elite
- Posts: 319
- Joined: Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:33 pm
- Location: Racine, WI
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
thank you kind sir
whats the deal w/ the powerlink on top? is that just stock size?
whats the deal w/ the powerlink on top? is that just stock size?
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
Greetings:
Gates belt photographed to reveal the sad truth: Made in China. You'd think we have the technology and talent to keep just some American icons sacred... Even if it costs a couple bucks more.
Gates belt photographed to reveal the sad truth: Made in China. You'd think we have the technology and talent to keep just some American icons sacred... Even if it costs a couple bucks more.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
I was going to suggest 1 up on the pilot jet but I think you need a real carb first
In 2040 they say we're going away
We could never let them control
Hawaiian man, take back your hawaiian land
We could never let them control
Hawaiian man, take back your hawaiian land
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Real Carb Fantasy
Greetings:
Quoth 808Beemer:
< I was going to suggest 1 up on the pilot jet but I think you need a real carb first>
You may have hit the Achilles' heel of stock carb tuning. I will read the plug after a true plug chop and see if I have enough "room" to go a tiny but smaller on the Main, then raise the needle to deliver richer mixture sooner. What do you think?
Quoth 808Beemer:
< I was going to suggest 1 up on the pilot jet but I think you need a real carb first>
You may have hit the Achilles' heel of stock carb tuning. I will read the plug after a true plug chop and see if I have enough "room" to go a tiny but smaller on the Main, then raise the needle to deliver richer mixture sooner. What do you think?
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Flash III, Phase I: Wrapup
Greetings:
So with Flash III easily and repeatably exceeding the Double-Nickel on GPS, I'll summarize:
Sleeper style! Only the double-centerstand gives it away.
So with Flash III easily and repeatably exceeding the Double-Nickel on GPS, I'll summarize:
Sleeper style! Only the double-centerstand gives it away.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Flash 3 Teardown
Greetings:
With just about 900 miles ridden, F3 entered semi-retirement in the Boudoir. F4 rests 'neath the '01 Elite needing only for me to summon the Gumption to adapt the PWK 28 carb, which can wait until break-in is completed.
I decided to inspect the Nikasil bore. Remember it suffered early abuse due to hopelessly lean jetting? Evidently this Nikasil is Tough. Nary a scratch marred its cylinder. Cross-hatching still clearly visible. A light touch of black goo on 25% of the combustion chamber dome, easily wiped off. The rest still sparkles. The piston likewise squeaky clean. Its only downside appears to be its stock-sized Boost port, no bigger than the crankcase cutout. It would require splitting the case again to enlarge... Hmmmm.
I built F4 complete, so F3 stands ready to swap in should the Ruima ministroker falter. Wonder what the PG long could do to improve on F3`s modest 60 MPH top end with that Boost hogged out? Hmmm...
Pics manana.
With just about 900 miles ridden, F3 entered semi-retirement in the Boudoir. F4 rests 'neath the '01 Elite needing only for me to summon the Gumption to adapt the PWK 28 carb, which can wait until break-in is completed.
I decided to inspect the Nikasil bore. Remember it suffered early abuse due to hopelessly lean jetting? Evidently this Nikasil is Tough. Nary a scratch marred its cylinder. Cross-hatching still clearly visible. A light touch of black goo on 25% of the combustion chamber dome, easily wiped off. The rest still sparkles. The piston likewise squeaky clean. Its only downside appears to be its stock-sized Boost port, no bigger than the crankcase cutout. It would require splitting the case again to enlarge... Hmmmm.
I built F4 complete, so F3 stands ready to swap in should the Ruima ministroker falter. Wonder what the PG long could do to improve on F3`s modest 60 MPH top end with that Boost hogged out? Hmmm...
Pics manana.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
- kingearwig
- Spree
- Posts: 207
- Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 6:04 am
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
Do you have a post detailing the double centerstand? I don't really understand how it helps get it off the ground better...and I don't understand how the two of them can function without interfering with each other.
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Re: Flash III Build Chronicles
Greetings:
Just another lame joke. I was monkeying with a lengthened stand and I took the pic with the stock one leaning against the tire.
Just another lame joke. I was monkeying with a lengthened stand and I took the pic with the stock one leaning against the tire.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Re: Flash III Resurrected
Greetings:
Waiting for Limp to send me a piston kit for Flash IV, riding Ol' Reliable Flash III 78cc Nikasil with about 1000 miles logged.
Setup is now with PG long, Mikuni TM24 running a 22.5 Pilot and a 170 main, needle one click rich from Center. Carburetion is pretty clean overall. Temps rarely approach 350 on cool mornings, more like 280 in the afternoons. Nikasil and its tiny boost port, 8.4:1 gears. 1/8-1/4 mile runup to:
Winds astern at 0-5. I've documented 59, probably gone 1-2 MPH faster on a long drafting or downwind run. Wheelman weighs ~200. TinyTach reads 9350. Mathematically it should be faster but I suspect maybe the ZX trans is not maxing overdrive. Then again, belt slip may be a bigger factor than I believed, and tiny boost port and maximum power may be the limiting factor.
Waiting for Limp to send me a piston kit for Flash IV, riding Ol' Reliable Flash III 78cc Nikasil with about 1000 miles logged.
Setup is now with PG long, Mikuni TM24 running a 22.5 Pilot and a 170 main, needle one click rich from Center. Carburetion is pretty clean overall. Temps rarely approach 350 on cool mornings, more like 280 in the afternoons. Nikasil and its tiny boost port, 8.4:1 gears. 1/8-1/4 mile runup to:
Winds astern at 0-5. I've documented 59, probably gone 1-2 MPH faster on a long drafting or downwind run. Wheelman weighs ~200. TinyTach reads 9350. Mathematically it should be faster but I suspect maybe the ZX trans is not maxing overdrive. Then again, belt slip may be a bigger factor than I believed, and tiny boost port and maximum power may be the limiting factor.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Re: Flash III Resurrected
Good to see your setup information. Now, we just need to get you a Malossi so we can compare notes.
- Wheelman-111
- Moderator
- Posts: 11325
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
- Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Re: Flash III Resurrected
Greetings:
I can't really go back to Malossi due to Radical Crankcase carvage on the Boost Port. I guess I could mount one to Flash 3, which has only minor adjustment to match the small Nikasil boost.
Tonight I tried to recapture the "Linear" carburetion F3 enjoyed before its hiatus. I had been running a 15 (!) pilot and a 160 main with the V8 28mm exhaust. Now with the PG, I reinstalled the carb as it had been tuned for F4 - the ministroked 90 - and found its 30/180 combo way rich. In several steps, I had it back down to 20/170. It ran cool at WOT and higher part-throttle settings, but I was seeing those scary temp spikes - as high as 400 when shutting off. It accelerated reluctantly too - a burbly symptom initially mistaken for too-rich.
Based only on the temp readings, I violated my own rule of "1 change at a time", and dropped the main from 170 to 165 while upping the pilot to a 22.5. Much better. Evidently the Pilot was lean (hot off-throttle spikes) while the main was too large (soft and cool on top). The PG Long needs a bit richer than the V8, but not as rich as I had selected. Now part-throttle accel is smoother without resorting to a sudden crack to half-throttle. Power on top is better too, and temps sticking closer to 350.
In some ways, a CHT might be a better guide to tuning than an EGT? I wouldn't mind having both, but running out of room on the dash.
I can't really go back to Malossi due to Radical Crankcase carvage on the Boost Port. I guess I could mount one to Flash 3, which has only minor adjustment to match the small Nikasil boost.
Tonight I tried to recapture the "Linear" carburetion F3 enjoyed before its hiatus. I had been running a 15 (!) pilot and a 160 main with the V8 28mm exhaust. Now with the PG, I reinstalled the carb as it had been tuned for F4 - the ministroked 90 - and found its 30/180 combo way rich. In several steps, I had it back down to 20/170. It ran cool at WOT and higher part-throttle settings, but I was seeing those scary temp spikes - as high as 400 when shutting off. It accelerated reluctantly too - a burbly symptom initially mistaken for too-rich.
Based only on the temp readings, I violated my own rule of "1 change at a time", and dropped the main from 170 to 165 while upping the pilot to a 22.5. Much better. Evidently the Pilot was lean (hot off-throttle spikes) while the main was too large (soft and cool on top). The PG Long needs a bit richer than the V8, but not as rich as I had selected. Now part-throttle accel is smoother without resorting to a sudden crack to half-throttle. Power on top is better too, and temps sticking closer to 350.
In some ways, a CHT might be a better guide to tuning than an EGT? I wouldn't mind having both, but running out of room on the dash.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Re: Flash III Resurrected
I'd love to have an integrated EGT and CHT gauge as part of my speedometer cluster, but that's not possible unless I lose the fuel gauge, which is so important for me.