86 Spree will not start.

[arey]

Spree Gurus

My son's Spree always ran fine. Only has 650 miles on it.

It's getting spark
Gas to the carb.
Replaced plug
cleaned carb
checked reeds
Has compressing
Has vacuum at carb intake.
Cranks over fine

But will not start!
If you blow into the small line the fuel will run out of the supply line. is that how the shut off valve should work?

The only thing I can think is last week he added premix 2 cycle oil to the oil tank as his oil light came on.
would this cause the injector screen to clog and cause it not to start?

I'm puzzled.
He has someone that wants to buy it so he can put it toward his first car now it won't start all of a sudden.

Please help.

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

How long has it been sitting since last started. Any "maintenance" done just prior to malfunction? Who/how was the carb cleaned?
Suggested checklist:

You didn't mention the airbox. Make sure its inlet/outlet aren't full of fossilized mice. EEeeK!

Pull that new plug and crank the engine for ~10 seconds. Assess whatever comes out the plug hole. Could be old goo has fouled your brand new plug.

Install a compression tester and verify ~100-ish at least. If so,

Install another new plug, check for good cap fit and try again.

No go?
Pull and clean carb as has been described in Tech Docs. Again...

[arey]

he rides it at least once a week never had to do anything to it it always ran.

When it didn't start I chacked the plug and it was pretty bad with a weak spark so I changed it but it didn't help.

I pulled the carb off disassembled it soaked it and blew everything out and reassembled it. No change.

Getting good spark.

It's like it is out of time or something

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

Timing is controlled at the flywheel and the mag pickup. If nobody moves anything, it should be set in stone until an electrical fault intervenes...

Have a look in that airbox?

[arey]

airbox is clean
even when I hand choke it it will not start it's weird

Thats why I thought maybe it has something to do with the injector if the inject is clogged will it not run as a safety feture???

[Lunytune]

Clogged oil injector may keep it from getting oil, but it won't keep it from starting.

Back to basics.
1. compression. As Guy sez, 100psi or better. You might have a broken ring. When they break, they don't give warning.
2. Ignition. You've confirmed that.
3. Carburetion. Fuel to the carb, (you said yes), fuel to the bowl (that's the next test), and through the carb to the engine.

There is a small screw at the lower left corner of the fuel bowl, that looks like an air or idle adjustment, but it's not. It's a drain for the bowl and also a check to see if there is fuel IN the bowl. My may have fuel TO the carb, but malfunctioning float valve may be stuck closed. That's what pulling the drain plug will tell you. Once you've confirmed that, we'll talk about the carburetor.

Back on ignition, sometimes the woodruff key on the flywheel will shear and timing will be off. Common on Briggs and Stratton lawnmower engines, not as common but possible on Honda scooters. So even though timing is not adjustable, there is a timing to be concerned with.

Since nothing else has been changed, if you have compression and ignition, properly timed, gas TO the carb, gas in the bowl, then you've got some clogged passages in the carburetor. If it won't start at all, I'd look at the bystarter and the tiny passage that goes down to the bottom of it.

[arey]

thanks
I'm going to go back through the carb again tonight.
there was gas to the float bowl.
I'll go over the bystarter.

Is the bystarter basically a choke?
So if it was the bystarter it would still fire when hand choked at the carb inlet correct?

This thing is driving me crazy.

[arey]

Last night I was going to tear the carb off again and decided before I did that I'd check to see if the exhaust port might be carboned up.
with only 600 miles on it doubtful but you never know.
I cranked it over and held my hand at the end of the muffler. No exhaust flow.

After further inspection I realized that the lovely "Mud dauber bees" we have here in michigan decided to lay their eggs inside of the exhaust and then plug the hole with mud.

after clearing the mud with a screwdriver I cranked it aver and a pile of green bee larva shout out and the the thing now runs fine.

HOW WEIRD IS THAT!

Thanks for the help anyway guys!

[Lunytune]

I cudda had a V-8. We just discussed that not long ago, but muddobbers and mice building nests in the airbox. Never realized they might also build in the exhaust. Glad you got it fixed.

So now you got a name for your scooter. The muddobber.

[Clivester]

You should have mentioned the aftermarket stinger pipe

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

Now, Bee-have, Clive.

Yes the Spree makes an ideal Wildlife Refuge. Now you can expect the black Suburbans to surround your garage and be questioned about destruction of Vital Habitat.

Really glad it was that simple.

[Spreetard]

i once got a wasp's nest like that in one of the two little intake ports on the airbox. i pulled the filter, cleaned the carb, etc., and finally noticed the tiny little obstruction. sprees are picky about airflow. and apparently bees will nest anywhere...

[Lunytune]

Who sez scooters aren't dangerous? I have been assaulted by muddobbers, dirt dobbers, wasps, yellowjackets and a few other things. Cleaning out a nest is not my favorite passtime. This is a very interesting mechanical problem.

And yes, I think Stinger Exhaust is most appropriate.

[tbplayer]

Given that there's already a thread for this and I've got the same symptoms, best not to start a new one I suppose.

My 85 spree that has given me much love (and is also my only form of transportation at the moment) decided not to start a little while back.

Things I have done:
Cleaned carb.
Replaced Spark Plug (twice!)
Cleaned/derusted flywheel.
Got new battery.

The cylinder was turning, but the darn thing just wouldn't start. After a pair of fresh sparkplugs and cleaning out the flywheel, I was able to get the plug to spark, but... when I went to try to get it to actually start the scooter, it stopped even trying to turn and instead started making a single "click" noise. I was able to trace the source of the solitary click to this little black box connected to the electrical system on the scooter's right side nestled in right next to the oil tank.

I have checked, and my airbox/exhaust is not home to any insect life, before you ask.

Problem seems to be electrical, but I can't find a busted fuse, and I don't know what to do from here. Any suggestions?

[Spreetard]

the first place i'd start; check the battery, then the starter relay, in that order. the black box you speak of is a relay, and if there was not enough voltage to turn the engine, it would just click.

One other point of curiosity...how's your compression??