RPM question

[trains420]

Having trouble getting my scooter tuned. So i thought i had 8.5 gram weights. who knows what I got. 9 or 8.5. i'm thinking 9 though. So, i went to 7.7 as some people said. I also tried 7gram. i noticed that aerorob said his 94-01 elite had the same exhaust, and he had an aftermarket variator, then later he got a 48mm big bore kit. he had the stock carb. well i had the stock carb.

i done the same aftermarket exhaust, V8 YWS blue exhaust. I done an aftermarket variator. I done 8.9:1 gears. he done 9:1 gears. Then i read he was getting 53mph, i think. ok so i've done all that, but could never tune my weights too good. but with some stock weights, it should have a high top speed. when does a top speed downhill really count so much. it should just get higher.

and my tire should spin faster, before my engine gets higher rpms with heavier weights, if it can get up to a fast speed. so ok, stock weights, i'm getting around 44mph on flat ground usually. sometimes, with it seems a little slope, i'll get up to 49mph. something. around 49 as long as it doesn't seem too sloped.

well let me talk about this, i got my aftermarket variator first. before, i couldn't go down this big hill, past 45 maybe top 47mph, something like that. thats all my scooter had. only put the variator on, and i went down that hill, and floored the speedometer that day.

ok so then later on i put all that other stuff on, exhaust, 8.9:1 gears.

well the thing is, with stock weights, the scooter runs, ok i've got 3 stock, and 3 7 gram weights in. mixed. but mixing weights, did not change the speed it changes gears at. seems like a good idea, to get what them weights equal in weights. but what i was wondering. and this is probably a long story, but it will explain a bunch of stuff to me, let me explain.

when i put the 7 gram weights in, the scooter wouldn't shift to 2nd. ok done there.

i got the 7.7 gram cause i thought, that aerorob had said he'd put them in and they where good weights for his scooter, and i thought 7.7 grams would give me more power. well, with the 9 grams, when i was pulling hills the engine was bogging down, a bunch, and would hardly pull 35 mph, it'd slow down to 30, when stock, it could hold the 35, and slowly creep down to 33. but this would drop to 30 quick. almost go slower, well it did, like 28.. it would bog, like a bunch.

was told, get lower weights, do compression check. i done a compression check.

anyway. ok so 7.7 gram weights, i put them in. and it got to where it wouldn't take off and almost seem to bog on flat ground. not even going 20 mph, just like it couldn't turn the clutch to get the springs to go, and the clutch grab the bell and it go, like it was bogging it down. but it did seem to have higher rpms, just it was bogging down going slow, on a flat place, like it was being choked.

so i was wonderring what do you guys think? the engines compression is 100psi. 14psi low. i was thinking it's the engine. but the variator i bought too, seemed really nice when i got it, and gave me a lot more speed. and i never put the pipe, and up my jet, without having the gears on. think maybe i got a lot of gears. cause with heavy weights my engine bogs down on hills, but with lighter weights, which should be ok, the engine can't push the scooter. it almost bogs down. it don't but it is straining. what do you guys think?


oh and something else. it's long i know, but i want to put 2 in 1. my brakes, new ebc. installed myself. right ones. question can tehy get old. what's happenning here. i was going down one of them roads to the lake, the real steep ones. this just explains it, ok the brakes ill hold them and they'll hold, then the hill will get steeper, or ill start going faster, and then i put more brake, but no more brake, and they get mushy. then oh they're bottommed out and i'm flying down the hill i switch to the other brake. then the other one i let off and use some and they slow me down. the brakes get like that anywhere though. and sometimes, almost bottom out. i hadn't been goign down that hill long, and it's a little scooter. something wrong with my brakes? the front brakes, ever since new ones, have squeaked, i took the tire off twice trying to find out what was doing it. i done it again the other day, and cleaned, what i thought was new brake dust. it quit, for one day. it's squeaking again. i mean it quit. what's making it squeak, it quit. thanks

[Trafficjamz]

Having trouble getting my scooter tuned. So i thought i had 8.5 gram weights. who knows what I got. 9 or 8.5. i'm thinking 9 though. So, i went to 7.7 as some people said. I also tried 7gram. i noticed that aerorob said his 94-01 elite had the same exhaust, and he had an aftermarket variator, then later he got a 48mm big bore kit. he had the stock carb. well i had the stock carb.

I would really recommend an aftermarket carb for that big of a bore.

[Trafficjamz]

i done the same aftermarket exhaust, V8 YWS blue exhaust. I done an aftermarket variator. I done 8.9:1 gears. he done 9:1 gears. Then i read he was getting 53mph, i think. ok so i've done all that, but could never tune my weights too good. but with some stock weights, it should have a high top speed. when does a top speed downhill really count so much. it should just get higher.

and my tire should spin faster, before my engine gets higher rpms with heavier weights, if it can get up to a fast speed. so ok, stock weights, i'm getting around 44mph on flat ground usually. sometimes, with it seems a little slope, i'll get up to 49mph. something. around 49 as long as it doesn't seem too sloped.

well let me talk about this, i got my aftermarket variator first. before, i couldn't go down this big hill, past 45 maybe top 47mph, something like that. thats all my scooter had. only put the variator on, and i went down that hill, and floored the speedometer that day.

Having close to the same secondary gears is only one factor for top speed.

Tire size and belt wear/stretch are a bigger factor of top speed than people seem to think.

And unless you both are recording your speeds in the same way,(same brand gps or same speed radar gun) you ar not really comparing apples to apples.

[Trafficjamz]

Ha
i got the 7.7 gram cause i thought, that aerorob had said he'd put them in and they where good weights for his scooter, and i thought 7.7 grams would give me more power. well, with the 9 grams, when i was pulling hills the engine was bogging down, a bunch, and would hardly pull 35 mph, it'd slow down to 30, when stock, it could hold the 35, and slowly creep down to 33. but this would drop to 30 quick. almost go slower, well it did, like 28.. it would bog, like a bunch.

You know that the roller weights work with th center spring. Right?
Are you two running the same center spring?

Lighter weights will let you climb hills better, but you will sacrifice top speed sometimes.

[Trafficjamz]

so i was wonderring what do you guys think? the engines compression is 100psi. 14psi low. i was thinking it's the engine. but the variator i bought too, seemed really nice when i got it, and gave me a lot more speed. and i never put the pipe, and up my jet, without having the gears on. think maybe i got a lot of gears. cause with heavy weights my engine bogs down on hills, but with lighter weights, which should be ok, the engine can't push the scooter. it almost bogs down. it don't but it is straining. what do you guys think?

100 psi does not seem right

Engines with only 100psi have starting problems and in general do not run very well at all.

I would check compression again, maybe with a different gauge.

If it is really at 100 , it might need new rings.

[Trafficjamz]

oh and something else. it's long i know, but i want to put 2 in 1. my brakes, new ebc. installed myself. right ones. question can tehy get old. what's happenning here. i was going down one of them roads to the lake, the real steep ones. this just explains it, ok the brakes ill hold them and they'll hold, then the hill will get steeper, or ill start going faster, and then i put more brake, but no more brake, and they get mushy. then oh they're bottommed out and i'm flying down the hill i switch to the other brake. then the other one i let off and use some and they slow me down. the brakes get like that anywhere though. and sometimes, almost bottom out. i hadn't been goign down that hill long, and it's a little scooter. something wrong with my brakes? the front brakes, ever since new ones, have squeaked, i took the tire off twice trying to find out what was doing it. i done it again the other day, and cleaned, what i thought was new brake dust. it quit, for one day. it's squeaking again. i mean it quit. what's making it squeak, it quit. thanks

Yes brakes (even high performance ones) wear out very quickly when you are going above 35mph, especially down hills.

Be careful

[trains420]

I would really recommend an aftermarket carb for that big of a bore.

im not the one with a 48mm big bore. i got stock bore. and it seems to be running with a good mixture. and running at a good temperature, but i don't have a guage.

[trains420]

Having close to the same secondary gears is only one factor for top speed.

Tire size and belt wear/stretch are a bigger factor of top speed than people seem to think.

And unless you both are recording your speeds in the same way,(same brand gps or same speed radar gun) you ar not really comparing apples to apples.

i think he had the same size tires then, and i got a brand new belt. and i was just using the speedometer, and yea he had a gps.
but it seems all i increased my mph by was maybe 5-7 mph, when i heard stock can do 40mph, with a good engine, and a not clogged up muffler. so, all that for 5-7 mph. when the gears should of done some good, got me at higher speed, and other people go faster.

[trains420]

You know that the roller weights work with th center spring. Right?
Are you two running the same center spring?

Lighter weights will let you climb hills better, but you will sacrifice top speed sometimes.

yea i think less weight on the motor, less stuff it's gotta turn would give you a higher speed up hills. but i think that contra springs don't affect shift. look what i have now, doesn't work. it works. but hey i wrote this post, and you read it. i want lighter than stock weights. it seems good. your arguing against that.
to answer your questions. i think we where both running 10% contra spring.
ive never heard anyone say stiffen up your center spring, so your suggestion just doesn't work. actauly i stiffened my center spring. because the variator was so steep, taht the spring couldn't push back down on it, at lower speeds, and i got stuck on hills in 2nd.
putting the new center spring in, i didn't get a later shift. at all. really maybe 1-2mph. from stock. maybe, maybe 1 mph. it wasn't nothing.

i mean what are you saying. so oh lighten or stiffen. but that is never the suggestion, and i don't know why you suggest that to me, this has been suggested. and i said before, there's no change in shifting except, which one is that, the from 2nd to 1st, downshift? whatever. im gonna say down. you can say im wrong, ill disagree.

but anyway, i have no contra spring problems. the clutch springs, are 2000rpm, and i think aerorob had the same thing.

but do clutch springs matter. no.

my springs fine thou, i can downshift, which is what i believe a contra springs for, unless i start racing. and stiffer srpings would just mean heavier weights anyway, maybe by just a little. and don't everyone jst about go with lighter weights. it's all i've ever heard what are you talking about. who has ever said, i got heavier weights. when just messing with their scooter a little and doens't have a big bore, or aftermarket carburetor. i have the stuff but. not heavier weights, and im not putting stiffer srpings, my shfifting is fine.

[trains420]

100 psi does not seem right

Engines with only 100psi have starting problems and in general do not run very well at all.

I would check compression again, maybe with a different gauge.

If it is really at 100 , it might need new rings.

the engine seems fine, but i don't know, as i said. i put a aftermarket variator on there, and some other parts to make more power. to push my more gears, and the 8.9:1 gears. but it seemed i needed to mess with my roller weights. i put the bigger gears, and the aftermarket variator on it, and it started bogging on hills. so i'm wondering, do i have too many gears for my motor, or is my motor too weak. too big gears, engine too weak?

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

You do not "make power" by swapping rollers and gears. Power is the product of internal combustion. The stronger those combustion cycles, and the faster they occur, the more power you'll make. At 100PSI, your engine isn't Being All That It Can Be.

I recommend you begin by addressing the reason for that low compression. Once the engine is up to full output, you can start messing with the gears and tuning the CVT. If you can't do that at this time, go back to stock gears and the rollers that produced the best results before.

By the way, you've used the expression "shifting into second gear" a few times. A CVT means Continuously Variable Transmission. There are more than two speeds, an infinity in fact. But there are two ratios, minimum and maximum, representing the lower and upper limits of belt travel. Honda Manuals say 2.4:1 off idle, and 0.8:1 "overdrive" when the belt reaches the outer rim of the front pulley. Those CVT values are multiplied by the Final Drive gear ratio. Most of the time, the transmission operates somewhere in between the two.

Your engine must have the RPM and the power output to achieve that "overdrive". If it's lacking there, you can make the belt shift sooner with slightly heavier rollers. However then you run smack into the power deficit as the speed picks up and wind drag increases. Lighter rollers keep the tranny closer to minimum upgear and help acceleration, but won't improve top speed either. It would take a steep downhill for your tranny to shift the belt all the way out to max and to go any faster.

[trains420]

i didn't claim it to be a power problem. i said rpm's. with more rpm's you make more power. i was just wondering, if i had enough power, or maybe my transmission was too much. so, if 8.4:1 gears, would do on a 50cc scooter, but i have 8.9:1, would that 8.4:1 do good, in some hills, would you have transmission tuning problems, or can 8.9:1 gears, with a variator, make close to the same gearing as the other gears. do i have enough power, or is my transmission too much. is what i'm kind of getting at.

[trains420]

hey come on. some answers here. i even gave an example of the logic you would use to answer this question. does anyone have an answer? i've already described in full, with plenty of detail.

[toad772]

hey come on. some answers here. i even gave an example of the logic you would use to answer this question. does anyone have an answer? i've already described in full, with plenty of detail.

You have been given answers but you chose to disregard them.

[trains420]

yea i guess that's why i kept asking questions. good response