1993 Honda Elite - 27MPH top end?

[themeltingclock]

Hi! New here - marginally mechanically inclined. I'm looking for suggestions as to why my Elite will only do about 27MPH on a good day. It's got 1800 miles on it - starts fine, runs okay, but really runs out of breath at the top end. My impression was that this should be able to reach/cruise at 30+MPH.

To get to the 27 MPH, I've developed a technique that might help you suggest the first things I should look at: I hold the throttle wide open until about 20MPH, then back off ~5degrees. The engine seems to pick up more steam by doing this than holding it wide open. Going by feel/sound, I apply more throttle in ~1degree increments until I hit 25MPH...then if I do this long enough, it will eventually reach ~27MPH.

Am I expecting too much? I live at ~5300feet altitude, so would a re-jetting/re-gapping be in order? I just bought this Sunday and don't have access to my full tool set at the moment, so I haven't been able to re-gap the plug and read it.

[eliteguy50]

Hi! New here - marginally mechanically inclined. I'm looking for suggestions as to why my Elite will only do about 27MPH on a good day. It's got 1800 miles on it - starts fine, runs okay, but really runs out of breath at the top end. My impression was that this should be able to reach/cruise at 30+MPH.

To get to the 27 MPH, I've developed a technique that might help you suggest the first things I should look at: I hold the throttle wide open until about 20MPH, then back off ~5degrees. The engine seems to pick up more steam by doing this than holding it wide open. Going by feel/sound, I apply more throttle in ~1degree increments until I hit 25MPH...then if I do this long enough, it will eventually reach ~27MPH.

Am I expecting too much? I live at ~5300feet altitude, so would a re-jetting/re-gapping be in order? I just bought this Sunday and don't have access to my full tool set at the moment, so I haven't been able to re-gap the plug and read it.

I've never had to regap but the one time I rode scooters in Colorado, I had to rejet to get close to proper performance. Do you have the elite SR?

[Bear45-70]

Just what is the altitude where you live.

[KingJeff801]

Sounds like it is still restricted?

[themeltingclock]

Hi! New here - marginally mechanically inclined. I'm looking for suggestions as to why my Elite will only do about 27MPH on a good day. It's got 1800 miles on it - starts fine, runs okay, but really runs out of breath at the top end. My impression was that this should be able to reach/cruise at 30+MPH.

To get to the 27 MPH, I've developed a technique that might help you suggest the first things I should look at: I hold the throttle wide open until about 20MPH, then back off ~5degrees. The engine seems to pick up more steam by doing this than holding it wide open. Going by feel/sound, I apply more throttle in ~1degree increments until I hit 25MPH...then if I do this long enough, it will eventually reach ~27MPH.

Am I expecting too much? I live at ~5300feet altitude, so would a re-jetting/re-gapping be in order? I just bought this Sunday and don't have access to my full tool set at the moment, so I haven't been able to re-gap the plug and read it.

I've never had to regap but the one time I rode scooters in Colorado, I had to rejet to get close to proper performance. Do you have the elite SR?

According to the VIN I have a SA50 Elite SR. If I were running a stock jet, what would I need to replace it with?

Just what is the altitude where you live.

Uh, I don't know. About 5280'.

Sounds like it is still restricted?

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't this model not restricted at all? It sure would make sense re: my performance.

[Bear45-70]

The stock jet is an 88 for a mile high you need something close to an 85 or maybe even a 82.

There was no restricted scooter in 1993.

[themeltingclock]

The stock jet is an 88 for a mile high you need something close to an 85 or maybe even a 82.

There was no restricted scooter in 1993.

Then there is no merit to this: http://www.scootertherapy.com/Eliteclutchpage.html ?

[Bear45-70]

In 1993 there was only one SA 50 and it was not restricted.

[Trafficjamz]

In 1993 there was only one SA 50 and it was not restricted.

really?

the LX was not restricted?

[themeltingclock]

I suppose I'm at a junction, then -

Either I rip apart the carb and replace the jet with a smaller number, which would likely gain me...maybe 3-4MPH(tops?)
-or-
I've been looking at this: http://www.exportstrength.com/product_i ... cts_id=681
Without re-jetting the carb, do you suppose the slight bump in cc's would make up for the rich condition up here and lean things out to a safe amount? I'm not looking to go 50mph, rather reach or slightly exceed 30mph and sustain it with reliability.

[Trafficjamz]

I suppose I'm at a junction, then -

Either I rip apart the carb and replace the jet with a smaller number, which would likely gain me...maybe 3-4MPH(tops?)
-or-
I've been looking at this: http://www.exportstrength.com/product_i ... cts_id=681
Without re-jetting the carb, do you suppose the slight bump in cc's would make up for the rich condition up here and lean things out to a safe amount? I'm not looking to go 50mph, rather reach or slightly exceed 30mph and sustain it with reliability.

Whoa wait

what engine do you have?

An af16 or a af05?

[themeltingclock]

According to this page:
http://www.jacksscootershop.com/honda_VIN.html
And all the research I did prior, I have a AF05E engine.

I tried to do my research before showing up here and making threads willy nilly but you guys use a lot of codes that makes it hard for someone from the outside to understand

[Trafficjamz]

All scooter jargon aside.....that 65cc kit you were looking at fits 94-01 elite S's (and SR's)

Get a variator/ramplate from a 94-01 elite. Yours is highly restrictive.

[noiseguy]

That bike should hit mid-30's with small changes... namely the variator.

Also, look at cleaning your carb out... the way you're talking about having to back down and up on RPM sounds like it's running lean.

[themeltingclock]

Now I've gone and done it. I ordered a variator from daywot on eBay and tried to install it today. Instead of speed gains....

.. my engine bogs at idle, will _barely_ hit 15mph. I have to help it along to even get to that point. However, once it hits ~15mph it starts to sound more like it should and I can get it up to ~20. I did two things that were not explained anywhere:
-Had to squeeze the rear drive plates apart (where the belt rides) to get enough slack in the belt to get the front drive plate back on.
-Did not re-use the o-ring that goes between the variator and interior face plate as it wouldn't stay in the groove with the three nuts tightened down.

I followed the instructions in the service manual to a T aside from those two differences. Did I inadvertently change the gearing negatively by squeezing the rear drive faces apart, letting the belt move more towards the center? I was careful to not get grease on the drive plates (but that stock one was FULL of it)...could that cause this issue?