'86 Spree won't start

[BrokeTheInterweb]

I bought an '86 Spree about 4 months ago from Craigslist. It was sold with several extras, like rope lights around the frame, two horns, a radio, and a large speaker on the back. Since the clock radio always displays the time, the guy threw in a battery maintainer to keep the battery in shape while it's not running. At first, it took a few tries to kickstart it, but the more often I used it the easier it was. After about 2 months though, it started taking maybe 10 minutes of exasperated kicking to get it to go. I use this as my primary vehicle, so I had no choice but to fight with it regularly just to get home from work.

I brought it to a shop which quoted me $175 for a spark plug replacement and a carb clean. I couldn't come close to affording that, so I reluctantly took it home (in pieces, since they wouldn't put it all back together after the free diagnosis.) I replaced the spark plug myself, it started once but the check oil light came on. I changed the oil, and I haven't been able to get it started since. (I learned how to do both those things from this site--thanks!)

Here are some pictures.

The maintainer is hooked up to the battery screws, but now it only appears to be charging when the key is in the ignition. I'm stumped, and I'm stuck without any transportation until I can get this fixed. Anyone have any ideas?

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

And welcome. Nice Spree Pics. First off, those holes in the airbox cover were a Really Bad Idea. Temporarily tape them over and see if starting improves just for that. Why doesn't the electric starter work?

The Check Oil light is just a bobber in the oil tank that lights when the level drops below a safe minimum. You can pry the sender from the tank and see if manually raising and lowering it shuts off/turns on the lamp. The oiling system in a Spree and most 2-strokes is an environmentally reprehensible "Total Loss" system. That's why we like 'em. Anyway, you don't "change" the oil so much as replenish it. The oil in the little gearcase at the rear axle does get "changed" once a year or so, but it's not monitored by the lamp. Anyway, if there's oil in the tank, ignore the lamp; that's all it's saying and a faulty circuit is simply that: faulty.

Adding a radio or any electronic farkle to a Spree is Risky Business. The charging system is just barely enough to keep up with the stock lights and ignition system. If there's a way to disconnect everything the Previous Owner added, it might simplify diagnosis. That battery doesn't look stock, and once again, any non-stock electrical component in a Spree is a gamble. If it's more than 2 years old, replace it. The Service Manual has step-by-step instructions for checking each component - there aren't that many. The Battery Maintainer should be hot-wired to the battery. If it only charges with the key on, the P.O. did something funky there too. See if you can go back to All-stock before proceeding.

Before you even go there, consider the Spree basics: Carb must be clean, and the tiny Pilot circuit can clog up for no apparent reason sometimes - disuse, mostly. The exhaust pipe gets carbon-caked, and that needs to be burned off thermally or chemically or the pipe replaced. Rings in the piston wear down, causing low compression. This too can make for hard starting. Compression testing ain't Rocket Science. Just wander down to Harbor Freight and ask for their $12.99 compressin gauge. Screw it on where the spark plug goes and kick 10 times or so. The Service Manual tells what you should read. Keep the reports coming and we'll try to help.

[paulpauly7]

cover those holes in the top of he air box first and see what happens

[patthesoundguy]

I agree with cover the holes in the airbox and go from there. A little duct tape should be a good temp fix. Try starting it, if it is still not wanting to start try putting your fingers over the intake holes at the back of the air boix as you crank it. that will act as a choke and give it more fuel, sometimes doing that can help dislodge somthing clogging up the carb so its worth a try. There can be crud in the tank blocking the filter screen, if it has less than half a tank of gas top it up and try starting it again, a friend had that problem on her aero once. with those holes in the airbox could that be a sign of the smaller big bore kit, if I remember right had instructions to drill a certain number of a certain sized holes in the air box cover. not that it means anthing if it ran right before. Did you check the gap on the plug, 0.025" is a good gap for the spree. maybe the plug is no good even if it is new... it happens from time to time. Dont worry there is always lots of help here on the forum Im sure we can get you back on the road, and you will be a spree veteran in no time.

[BrokeTheInterweb]

Thanks guys! Covered the holes with duct tape to see if that helped. It has a nice purr when it's kicked, but unfortunately still no spark. I've been trying to get my hands on a compression gauge, but I'm too broke to pick one up right now. I give it gas when I kick it, and the tank's been full for over a month, so I'm wondering if it is a dirty carb, especially since that's what the shop quoted me for.

I tried to remove the carb to clean it, but I couldn't quite figure out how to remove it completely. I disconnected everything from it and there didn't seem to be any obstructions in the tubes, but if someone could help me out with how to remove it altogether, I could give it a good clean.

Forgot to mention I removed the giant speaker on the back, thus removing my rear signals in the process, but once I can get it started with as little stress on the battery as possible I can put the lights back on. Just wanted to make sure it wasn't a weak battery issue. The battery's working fine with the maintainer now which is good news, so I don't think that's the main problem.

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

Don't give it ANY throttle when kick-starting or using the E-Start.
What's wrong with the Electric Start again? If you haven't already, remove the spark plug and install a new one. Sometimes that's the ONLY problem.

If the carb must come off:
1. Loosen the clamp to the airbox.
2. Spin off the throttle cap.
3. Loosen the clamps holding the fuel line and vacuum line - if the fitting is on the carb and not the manifold - and pull the rubber line(s) off their respective fittings.
4. The carb is held to the intake manifold flange/insulator by two 8mm hex bolts. You need an extension - I use a fairly long one - between the ratchet and the 8mm socket. Lefty-loosey both of those and the carb shoud just fall off.
5. Note the position of the brown plastic "Insulator" between the mani and carb. There are 4 ways to reinstall it. Only one is correct.
6. Follow Tech or WikiSpreedia instructions to clean the carb.
7. Reinstall the squeaky-clean - If you're lucky...- carb in the reverse order of disassembly. Those little bolts are frighteningly easy to over-torque and strip the threads in the carb flange. You need to compress the two rubber o-rings, but not much more.

[BrokeTheInterweb]

The electric starter doesn't work, the previous owner warned that it hasn't for a while. Thanks for the instructions! I will do this later today and give it a good cleaning-out.

[BrokeTheInterweb]

Got it to run! But something really weird happened. When I ride it, it's extremely slow and sluggish, and it won't even consider going up an incline. But once I get off of it and put the stand down, it goes nuts. Here's a video. It starts when I'm still sitting on it, and then you can see the engine accelerate violently when I stand it up. What could that be?

[patthesoundguy]

I bet the air hose isnt hooked up or the clamp is really loose. Is there an air filter in the air box, and is there a rubber gasket in the air box cover. You may need to get a little sheet of thin plexiglass and cut some to cover the holes and silicone it in place.

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[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

What Pat said, or the carb's Pilot circuit is gummed. Carb still needs to come off I guess, since it was only 28 minutes to get it running. Did it respond just to not cracking throttle? A New spark plug is still a good idea.

[BrokeTheInterweb]

It started after just a few kicks when I stopped trying to give it gas, thanks for that tip. I hope I didn't damage my engine doing it all those other times. The spark plug is brand new, and I'm relieved to know it's not a dud. I'll take the carb out and clean it, since it definitely can't survive in normal traffic in its current state.

[patthesoundguy]

New plug is a must 0.25 gap
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[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

No Spree can survive Normal Traffic unless that means the nursing home hallway to the Cafeteria on Pork Chop Friday. Sinceriously, they're good for 30MPH but will run that speed all day long. Just pull over for the lady pulling the oxygen tank. Two-Stroke hater with sharp elbows...

[JJ Joseph]

All of the above is good advice. Pay extra attention to the low-speed jet. It has a really tiny hole that can clog easily, and it won't idle if it's plugged. It's about a .25mm hole (about the thickness of 2 sheets of paper|). Make sure you can see daylight through it. Check the main needle isn't worn where the circlip attaches. This happens in old Hondas. If it's looking like it will snap at that point, try to find a new needle or solder the circlip to the old needle in the middle position. You don't want it to break in traffic as you're wheezing along flat out at 30mph!

[Budster]

My elite would start but had no power, went maybe 5 mph, and would go nuts up on the center stand. I took a chance that the muffler was all clogged up, so drilled a hole up the back end of the pipe ( not really knowing what I was doing but figured it could not hurt the 'performance' any more than what I had. That elite now goes faster than I care to ride it so maybe it will work on your bike. basically just took a 5 inch long 3/8 diameter drill and starting ramming a hole in the back end of the muffler until I hit a part of the main pipe in the muffler. not rocket science but apparently the muffler was all clogged up with the overly generous amount of oil in the air fuel mix. funny part was I bought the bike from some guy who I tried to talk into fixing the bike using this same method. he didn't want to try it so I paid him 100 bucks and now I got a great ride for almost nothing.