84 Nifty Fifty won't start

[vinnie]

Had my Nifty Fifty working great for ages, then one day I had to lift the scooter over something, so I "wheelied" it up (with engine not running) and pushed it along on one wheel for a couple of metres. Ever since that day, it was very difficult to start, sometimes REFUSED to start, sometimes started straight away... and I finally ran down the battery from trying to start it.

Anyway, 7 months later, I bought a new battery and installed it, cleaned the carb with WD40 and reassembled, also checked the reeds and they seemed to be all good. Spark is great, the bowl is filling (checked by unscrewing the drain screw), tried it with and without restricting the air intake. Turns over fine.

Bystarted is stuffed, doesn't work. Tried it with needle and ring in, with no needle, with no ring or needle, still nothing. Just turns over and doesn't fire up. Tried it with my finger covering the hole... still no luck.

Top end is newly rebuilt with 0.5mm oversized piston.

The petrol is 7 month old 91 octane. I'm really unsure of what's causing this. It wouldn't be the age of the petrol? I figure I've got spark, compression, petrol and air, so what the crap? Oh, also it's winter here in New Zealand, in the garage it's about 10┬░C (50┬░F) at a guess. Would that affect it?

Thanks in advance for any hints.

[CaptDan]

cleaned the carb with WD40 ....(snippage)..The petrol is 7 month old 91 octane. I'm really unsure of what's causing this.

I'll probably catch some flack from the x-perts about this, but it's a bad idea to
clean carbs with (W)ater (D)isplacement - {formula attempt} #40. I'd wager your carb is now hostage to the unholy marriage between Formula Attempt #40's gummy afterbirth and the glue-like offspring of stale petrol.

So..................remove carb, disASSemble.' Soak parts (not gaskets) in a can of Gunk or similar carb cleaner. Blow out all passageways (including the sub-atomic diameter bystarter port) with compressed air/carb cleaner spray. Inspect carefully, ensure proper float valve operation and reASSemble.

CaptDan>

[Scooterspal]

The petrol is 7 month old 91 octane.

How does your country rate octane? That is, what we call regular grade 87 octane in the US is 91 in most of Europe. Is 91 your regular grade gas? If so it is the proper grade for your scooter. Running high octane is not a good idea. If you have Shell in your area it's the best gas around IMHO.

For starters, I'd drain that old gas completely if you can and add fresh (87/91) octane. I found, when I rebuilt my carb the settings for the idle and the air mixture are critical and a bit tricky. I could not start my scooter with the so-called initial settings of 1.5 turns out. Mine are about 3 turns out from full in. I get a quick start, smooth but very low idle and my plug is a dark brown... meaning the air to fuel the mixture is exactly correct.

[vinnie]

Hey there, yep it's standard grade, I believe we do it the same as Europe.

Anyway, I replaced the carburettor with another one that I had since the bystarter was stuffed and the other carburettor has a manual choke, but I also had to replace the air intake tube, intake manifold and reeds because they were of a smaller diameter than the previous carby. It started last night and ran choppy, but ran all the same! Yay.

BUT... today it won't run again! I had it running for a few seconds after spraying WD40 down the jug but then as soon as it burns that up it dies again. Turning it over at WOT gives me little pops but nothing happens. I think it's not getting enough air maybe? Having my finger over the choke hole doesn't make a difference. The plug is black and wet, which led me to think either too much fuel or not enough air. I cleaned the carb thoroughly before putting it in.

But what I am worried about is whether or not the "new" carby is incompatible with the engine(?) does that make sense? Also, should the screws on the side of the carb be wound in or out? One is the idler (the top one) but what is the one below it?

Cheers everyone

[vinnie]

OK, just replaced the old petrol with new and cleaned the carb again. STILL NOTHING. Now it won't even start with WD40 down the jug.

I don't understand. How could this happen? It was running last night and now, magically overnight it refuses to fire up? It's driving me crazy. I feel like tearing out my hair and scratching out my eyes. This thing has given me so much trouble it's like a demon haunts it! Does everyone else have as much trouble as I do?

If anyone has ANY hints for me to try, I'd be so grateful!!!

[noiseguy]

My guess: fouled plug.

[vinnie]

What's the best way to clean a plug?

[Lunytune]

What's the best way to clean a plug?

Get a new one.

I've heard that WD40 works great for arthritus. I prefer aspirin
WD40 works fair on rusty tight threads, but not frozen threads. I prefer Blaster for that.
I have a can or two around, for the wife's sewing machine, etc, but it don't come within 50 feet of my Honda Carburetor! Get rid of it. Don't even use it as a starter fluid. They make a starter fluid for that purpose, and they make Carb Cleaner in spray can for flushing out passages. Both of these are available at WalMart and auto supply stores. The Gunk for soaking the carburetor is available at Autozone. It comes in a gallon can with a basket. It is well worth it for other stubborn cleaning project too. But it's not a paint or spray. It's strictly a soaking operation. American cost $20. I don't know what it would cost in Kiwi land, but I'm sure an equivalent in money exchange. If you don't have Autozone, ask any mechanic and he'll tell you where to get it.

I may sound a little sarcastic about the WD40, but I'm learning that 99.9% of Honda problems are in the carburetor, and fresh gas and cleanliness is vital. They don't like oil or varnish or trash in the system. I'm suspicious of Ethanol too. It plays havoc in automobile injection systems so you can imagine what it does to a two stroker.

[Kenny_McCormic]

I would recommend you buy a new plug.