2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Does your Spree/Elite already run great, and you're trying to make it quicker/faster? Need a monster motor swap? Discuss your ideas here.

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Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Might take you up on that tach offer.

Installed the Polini White contra with 9g rollers. Still feels light and still tops out at 54, but I'm sure the spring needs to settle in. I'll probably buy a roller kit with some heavier rollers to play around with. Just seems weird. Is it normal to run a setup like this with that much weight?

I'm glad I went with 8.44:1 over the 9:1. There is some hit to the take-off but acceptable for my usage. It cruises nicely without too much throttle around 40, where I'll probably be spending the majority of the cruising time. I wanted to share how I mounted my license with low-profile taillights since I know some guys use weird mounts:

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All I did was use a regular metal license plate frame, but instead mount it backwards by drilling small holes in the frame for two bolts to go through the mudguard mount holes. On the back I used large fender type washers with nuts. You can see a little bit of the bolt head by the red arrows behind the plate. Fast and easy to do plus no extra holes in the mudguard.

A little sneak preview before the unveiling. It was stock yellow with some minor body damage and dirty. Pretty much everything but the frame got repairs and a new paint job:

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"Is that a smartphone mount bolted through the mirror nut with a USB power cord that turns on with ignition!?", you ask. Good eyes is all I have to say.

Now back to business. This was a brand new plug before this run:

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Yea, not too pretty. Sure doesn't look like a plug running a huge main. There is some oil residue around the threading and near the plug sealing point. I removed the crush washer and used the copper CHT ring per Trailtech instructions. Maybe this is air leak source?
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Rip_City_Spree
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rip_City_Spree »

Take him up on the offer. Looking great but I'm partial to black.
01 Elite SR
polini corsa
Polini 26mm Carb
Naraku intake
Naraku sport variator
Currently 5g rollers
zx trans
Arrow
red contra with yellow clutch springs.
RIP CITY
RIP NO MERCY KERSEY
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

I'll let the new Polini White contra break in before making any weight adjustments. Tach ordered and on the way so I can see what it's actually turning at WOT. What I don't get is if it is indeed high revving at say 9k, shouldn't I be getting more than 54mph with 8.4s? The issue would have to be an air leak sapping power or a slipping trans wouldn't it?

I'm considering trying a BR9HIX to see what happens. There shouldn't be any performance hit going colder right?
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Oh, I wanted to throw out another cosmetic tip I did to the buttons with depressed faded lettering. I used whiteout to fill the depression, then used denatured alcohol on a rag to wipe the raised areas clean. You have to rub pretty hard to clean it up. I've found the whiteout to be surprisingly resilient.
Rancher1
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Re: Dio hill climber

Post by Rancher1 »

curtis966 wrote:The 8s will do you fine. Just make sure you gap it correctly.
Do all new plugs need to be re-gapped? I read in another thread the 8 should be gapped to 0.24mm. I hadn't touched any of my plugs.
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Swapped in a Keihin #88 main to try. Temp went up faster. Air leak or not, smaller jet isn't helping. I might try a fan scoop. Oh, I've been running it without the body panels on it. I don't 'think' that should effect the fan's cooling effectiveness, but not sure.

Sprayed exterior with carb cleaner, no reaction. Checked head bolts, some could use a little tightening. Hmm, this one seems particularly loose, aaaaaaaand...

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Time for upgraded studs and a torque wrench. Honda says 7.2 ft-lbs. Maybe a smidgen higher?

Might as well take a look at the top end. Sure looks like it's getting oil..

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Hmm, a little oil on the base gasket I might have a try something later when it's all together.
curtis966
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by curtis966 »

I gap all my plugs to .25. Some come pre gapped I'm sure but idk to what spec. And when you re assemble use copper spray on your gaskets. It really helps seal up any tiny imperfections that can cause a air leak.
86 Aero 50,Polini 65cc BBK,malossi oring head,100 oct. 32:1
21mm OKO,Malossi Wild Lion exhaust,
Stock Ruck vari, malossi special belt,1.5k shoes,1k center,
aftermarket bell, front/rear metro wheels, TT vapor,
5in stretch on motor mount,280mm Shock.
1man8scoots
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by 1man8scoots »

You had an air leak if you snapped that head bolt with just a little more torque. It was stretched before.
I'm quite sure malossi recommends 1.2 kgm or around 9 point something ft/lbs for their kits. I do 10 on the click style torque wrench. When doing kits you follow the spec of the kit.
1man8scoots
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by 1man8scoots »

On my sport and race cylinders I always gap at .32. I run supposedly hotter coils than stock.
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Got everything back together. Man 10 ft-lb is light. I've been way over cranking everything. Clean and sprayed the base gasket with copper gasket sealer:

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Installed the air scoop from Graphite by cutting away the edge of the shroud and screwing down. Pan head #6 fits well, 3/4" works but 1" may be stronger, and stainless steel because that adds 1 mph (and supposedly better corrosion resistance). It was a surprisingly easy and straight forward install:

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Haven't tried fitting the skirt and jumping on the bike. It's possible it might hit but I'll check it out later.

Switched out to a BR9HIX. Installed tach. Installed a #100 main jet and believe I've found the upper limit on jet size. It bogged and smoked like a party fog machine on fire. Switched it out to #94 and it looks/sounds happy. Going to test it tomorrow and watch temps. Idling at 1600 RPM it sits in the low 170s.
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

I recently did a plumbing job and the general technique for pipe fitting is tight + one good wrench grunt. Well, to get my 1.25" brass fittings to finally seal and not leak, it needed RectorSeal No. 5 sealant, tight + 5 blood-vessel popping, hernia inducing wrench grunts. I always wondered how that sealant got it's name.
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Did another test run. It's definitely running cooler, but not as cool as I'd like. Changed three things: reseated cylinder with copper gasket spray, changed to BR9HIX plug, added air scoop. I can still bring it up to 370F with WOT for awhile, but this is the first time I've been able to hold WOT through my entire test run without breaking 375F spike. Definitely cooler.

It's running ~7500 RPM at WOT. The center spring is settling in as now I can feel it's running a bit too heavy on the weights. I doubt lighter weights will cap my top end now that the spring is settled, as 7500 RPM at WOT means the pulley system (with Polini vari) is maxed and it's the 8.4 gears making it work hard. Does anyone know if 8500 RPM is max HP for the Malossi cast with stock pipe/carb? 7500 RPM doesn't feel slouchy but I'm curious to try ultra light weights to feel 8500+ RPM.

I got some parts to fab a positive pressure leak setup so may work on that in the next few days.
Rancher1
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

Did another test run with new weights, 37.5g (5.6g x 3, 6.9 x 3), and it's looking like I'm too light again with a speed cap of 46 MPH at 8100 RPM. The butt dyno feels like there isn't much power being made at 8100 and 7500 felt a lot stronger. Going to get around to that leak test setup and switch back to heavier weights in the meantime. Graphite, have you ever dyno'd a similar stock setup with an unported Malossi cast?

Does anyone know the heat relationship between an engine at lower RPM under load vs. a higher RPM under less load? I would think the lower RPM would generate less heat even under a heavier load, however the fan would be spinning slower so less cooling air.

The air scoop slightly rubs on the skirt when the shocks near bottom out:

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Tip for future installers: you can either shave down the scoop a little there, shave/notch the skirt out a little, or mount the scoop with in a slight upward slant (mine is oriented directly straight ahead). I think I'll leave it for now as the skirt will flex when it gets hit.
curtis966
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Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by curtis966 »

Engine temps at higher rpms are lower a lot of the time because of the higher amount of fuel filling the cylinder which in turn cools the cylinder. Your highest temps are usually seen when you let off the throttle from wot especially with a stock carb because of the in adjustable pilot. And I think you wanna be in the 8-9k range for you cast kit that's what I've heard anyway I've never owned one.
86 Aero 50,Polini 65cc BBK,malossi oring head,100 oct. 32:1
21mm OKO,Malossi Wild Lion exhaust,
Stock Ruck vari, malossi special belt,1.5k shoes,1k center,
aftermarket bell, front/rear metro wheels, TT vapor,
5in stretch on motor mount,280mm Shock.
Rancher1
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Joined: Sun May 03, 2015 8:27 pm
Location: NorCal

Re: 2000 Elite S Build - "Mr. Grey"

Post by Rancher1 »

curtis966 wrote:Engine temps at higher rpms are lower a lot of the time because of the higher amount of fuel filling the cylinder which in turn cools the cylinder.
But if the throttle is wide open for both RPM scenarios, the amount of fuel in the cylinder would be a function of how much fuel is being brought in with the air delivery (which may vary).

I guess a good analogy would be like going WOT up a hill in 4th gear vs. 5th gear. 4th gear will have less load at higher RPM, vs. 5th gear with higher load and lower RPM. We'll ignore maintaining the same speed since we're talking about WOT. Intuitively one would think the lower RPM under load at WOT would bring in fuel that doesn't get fully burned, hence cooler running. Am I looking at it wrong?
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