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Keeping Spree Elite Aero 50cc and Gyro Alive!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:58 am 
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I've installed an 80cc BBK on my Dio and it's got bags of power now. Initially it topped out at 58km/hr so I upgraded the stock belt with a new Malossi Kevlar belt which is about 2mm wider. Now the Dio blasts up to 80km/hr (terrifying)! But the heavy Kevlar belt is too much for the Dio starter. It kick-starts just fine, on the first poke. But the electric starter can't handle the belt and won't start. I have a friend with a BBK Yamaha with the same problem. The 50cc starters are just too weak. Does anyone know of a replacement electric starter that fits a Dio and can turn the heavy Kevlar belt?


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:57 am 
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Maddog does. :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 12:07 pm 
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Greetings:

If the belt is 2mm wider, did you shim the front pulley to match? I'm not sure how that would work otherwise. Which Malossi belt?

Anyway, the weak starter probably isn't a belt issue at all. Higher compression has made for sketchy e-starting on a couple of my builds however. The stock starter turns anything under 125PSI over pretty easily. Above that, it can stutter, especially when the engine is cold. A couple of pokes with the kicker usually freed it up enough for the e-start to work. MadDog frequently boasted of his no-longer-available Hi-Torque Starter. Nobody else I know of ever had one.

Check your compression. Over 135 can be asking for trouble unless you jet way rich - not so good for performance. Another option is to run higher-octane fuel - not so good for the Billfold. Either way, the starter won't work any better. What's wrong with Kick-starting?

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:21 pm 
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Could you swap in an electric start off a bigger cc honda motor?
Or would that still not work because its more about the pressure than the cc?

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:07 pm 
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Petrock's 1984 Spree wrote:
Could you swap in an electric start off a bigger cc honda motor?
Or would that still not work because its more about the pressure than the cc?

It is about torque. A larger starter would work but finding one that would fit will be hard.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:12 pm 
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So would one off an Elite 80 (CH80) fit on an elite 50?

Someone out there has to have the parts to try that in matter of 5 minutes :smile:

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1984 Iowa Spreedio aka "Hammy"
-72cc Polini Corsa
-V8 Typhoon Exhaust
-21mm OKO & CT Mani
-ZX Trans 1k Contra
-8.44:1 Gears
-Polini 2 Shoe Clutch
-Koso Vented Clutch Bell
-Polini Ruckus Vari w/ 6.9g weights
-669x18x30 Belt


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:15 pm 
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Petrock's 1984 Spree wrote:
So would one off an Elite 80 (CH80) fit on an elite 50?

Someone out there has to have the parts to try that in matter of 5 minutes :smile:

You can look at them side by side in about 5 seconds. If the dimensions are not the same, it depends on how much work you want to do to customize it. You can make one if you want to put enough hours into it.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:50 pm 
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they sell stroker startes (madDog's hi torque) for "S" block and the speedcell battery can turn over a 107 stroker. and about the psi i ran 140psi on my 72 and it started fine. i think vt cycles can still get them...

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:12 pm 
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just thinking wouldn't more cranking amps from like a car battery also fix the problem, obviously a car battery wont work but maybe a larger scooter/motorcycle battery would? the dealership the wrong size of battery in my car recently and it would barely crank it over enough to start

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:09 am 
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bc117 wrote:
just thinking wouldn't more cranking amps from like a car battery also fix the problem, obviously a car battery wont work but maybe a larger scooter/motorcycle battery would? the dealership the wrong size of battery in my car recently and it would barely crank it over enough to start


That's not how electricity works.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:23 am 
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bc117 wrote:
just thinking wouldn't more cranking amps from like a car battery also fix the problem, obviously a car battery wont work but maybe a larger scooter/motorcycle battery would? the dealership the wrong size of battery in my car recently and it would barely crank it over enough to start

Not providing enough current will do that. Providing too much current (the theory behind e-start) is already going on. Putting too much current to a motor will ruin it. A larger battery would provide more to draw from but (as Bear said) it will not force the starter to turn the motor over.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:48 am 
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Wheelman-111 wrote:
What's wrong with Kick-starting?


Ewww! Kick-starting is so "1950s". I paid $500 for this thing and I want all the modern features. Anyway, I took the starter to the auto electric shop and they cleaned up the armature and replaced the brushes for $25 (they laughed at the size of the thing). It was just old and worn out. Like me.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:17 pm 
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JJ Joseph wrote:
Wheelman-111 wrote:
What's wrong with Kick-starting?


Ewww! Kick-starting is so "1950s". I paid $500 for this thing and I want all the modern features. Anyway, I took the starter to the auto electric shop and they cleaned up the armature and replaced the brushes for $25 (they laughed at the size of the thing). It was just old and worn out. Like me.


did that solve your issue?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 2:54 am 
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Chicago Ben wrote:
did that solve your issue?


Yup. Months later it's still working fine.


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